እትም በ11:09, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 አርም Codex Sinaiticus (ውይይት \| አስተዋጽኦ) 20,425 edits አንድ ለውጥ 351939 ከYann (ውይይት) ገለበጠ unwanted harassment. Stop preaching acceptance of homosexuality at me please. It is pointless as I do not share your homosexual perspective and experience and you do not own me Tag: Undo ← የፊተኛው ለውጥ		እትም በ12:45, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 አርም ለውጡ ይገለበጥ Acagastya (ውይይት \| አስተዋጽኦ) 2 edits re Tags: በንፋስ ስልክ Mobile app edit iOS app edit የሚቀጥለው ለውጥ →
መስመር፡ 609፦ ::: I don't understand what homophobia is. Only homosexuals seem to know what it means when receive they militantly persecute anyone who dissents from them, with their firebrands and pitchforks. This is not an Amharic-translatable concept, it's not even proper English as it originated in recent decades as a homosexual slang term and no one else really knows what it means. If it means everything in human society that they want to destroy, I suppose it would be what we call not homophobia but "civilization" - thousands of years of it. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 01:59, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) == QueerEcofeminist block == ~~== Notice of removal of sysop and bureaucrat permissions ==~~ Hello. The block of user QueerEcofeminist came to my attention today. Though I have read block reasons, I can’t find anything on the name that could be a reason for a block on any Wikimedia project, which is supposed to be free, gay-friendly, and respect orientation of users. Is there any local policy for username block here? They also requested unblock via own talk page, which is the usual recommendation on any project, but you deleted it and disallowed talk page access. Hello. Using the sysop tools in a dispute while involved in it, to block editors you disagree with them, is a blatant abuse of the sysop tools. In order to protect the project and its editors from such abusive use of the sysop toolset, I have removed your sysop and bureaucrat permissions. Best regards, --[[አባል:MarcoAurelio\|MarcoAurelio]] ([[አባል ውይይት:MarcoAurelio\|talk]]) 01:10, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC: :I rightfully blocked him, because he is only here to miltitate against our longstanding policy since 2005 against advocacy of homosexuality, which is deeply offensive to Ethiopian culture and a violation of the Ethiopian criminal code. He was making a disturbance and would force people to be unwillingly offended in the service of promoting homosexuality internationally. For you to unilaterally and whimsically remove my management of this wiki without any consensus discussion or process of appeal is the abuse of power and a disgusting disgrace. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 01:20, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :: [[User:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] or [[User:Codex Sinaiticus\|Codex Sinaiticus]], please provide a link to this project's policy with regard to ''"advocacy of homosexuality"'' being an instant block offence? Individuals making claims about what they think consensus on this project are, is not the same as providing evidence of consensus. From responses so far, and the apparent near absence of any articles on this project about homosexuality or LGBT+ history, is it reasonable to conclude that attempts to create articles on this topic to improve the Wikipedia would be treated as "advocacy of homosexuality"? :: Please take on board that your complaint that your sysop rights were removed without consensus, or process of appeal, is factually incorrect. The action was taken with the justification of high level policies against abusive use of tools, which [[User:MarcoAurelio\|MarcoAurelio]] can provide further links to if you are unaware of them. You are free to appeal, or indeed run a consensus vote to have these rights restored. :: Ironically, [[User:QueerEcofeminist]] has not been allowed the same respect extended to yourself, instead [[User:Codex Sinaiticus\|Codex Sinaiticus]] has denied access to their talk page to appeal the block for having the word "Queer" in their account name. The above block of the projects steward [[User:Teles\|Teles]], when they were attempting to assist by asking in a civil fashion about the block, appears to be a coordinated use of sysop privileges actively to suppress discussion about this project's hostile approach to LGBT+ topics. Worryingly, this sets the Amharic Wikipedia community in conflict with WMF policies and stated values. For these reasons the way sysop rights are being used on this Wikipedia has drawn attention from the wider community, and our views as highly experienced Wikimedians, count here as much as they do on any other Wikimedia project we volunteer on, and should be responded to in good faith, factually and without hostility or harassment. :: Thanks --[[አባል:Fæ\|Fæ]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Fæ\|talk]]) 02:25, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC)▼ I was admin here from 2005. At that time homosexuality was also still considered a crime in the US, by the way. I don't know when wmf adopted this policy of abandoning neutrality and forcing their peculiar values on every language on the globe. But they have never paid me a penny for contributing anything here for free all those years, so I don't feel as if you own me and don't feel obliged to comply with your dictates. It should be known they have a policy of pushing large sums of money around back and forth for anything but contributing which must be voluntary work by the ones you want to do the work. [[User:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ፈቃደ]] ([[User talk:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ውይይት]]) 02:41, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :In 2003 the United States Supreme Court ruled that homosexuality, in short, is a constitutionally protected right. (Lawrence v. Texas) Regardless, blocking someone for their sexual orientation is quite far from neutral. [[አባል:Vermont\|Vermont]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Vermont\|talk]]) 02:50, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) Sorry to crush your hopes Vermont, but you are not going to convince me of anything, ever! [[User:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ፈቃደ]] ([[User talk:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ውይይት]]) 03:01, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::: I do not speak for the WMF, never worked for them, nor have I ever been paid a penny for my contributions in any way. The community of volunteers takes part literally to do no more than improve the sum of human knowledge. ::: Regardless of the fact that homosexuality is a crime in Ethiopia, this is an irrelevant point as to whether volunteers are free to write about and discuss LGBT+ related topics on the Amharic Wikipedia or whether volunteers who identify as LGBT+ risk arbitrary blocks on this project because they are LGBT+. Writing an article is a ''neutral'' act of itself, as articles are intended to be neutral and fact based, not editorials that advocate a single point of view. For these reasons simply writing factual articles about homosexuality is not a crime under Ethiopian law. ::: Regardless of personal views about LGBT+ rights or the current Ethiopian law, this project must comply with Wikimedia Foundation hosting policies as described in the website terms of use. Anyone who fundamentally disagrees with those policies, and is seen to actively work against them, by definition is not here to create or improve the encyclopaedia. ::: If any administrator uses sysop tools to promote a personal political view, like believing homosexuals are "subhuman", rather than to support the creation and improvement of the encyclopaedia, then by definition they cannot be trusted with sysop tools. --[[አባል:Fæ\|Fæ]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Fæ\|talk]]) 03:06, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) As I said that is what the majority in Ethiopia would think. But to make it clear, let me spell it out, you have ZERO CREDIBILITY with me now so you are rather wasting your time talking to me. [[User:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ፈቃደ]] ([[User talk:Codex_Sinaiticus\|ውይይት]]) 03:18, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) So, could you kindly review this block? Perhaps asking opinion of other admins to have a second opinion. I am just failing to see what is the harm on leaving this account unblocked. I hope you can help me to understand. Thanks in advance.” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 22:36, 6 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) It is not wrong to have certain political/religious views, but it is inappropriate to force them on others in this manner. I will also note the inflammatory racial terms used [https://am.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%E1%8A%A0%E1%89%A3%E1%88%8D_%E1%8B%8D%E1%8B%AD%E1%8B%AD%E1%89%B5:Til_Eulenspiegel&oldid=343384 here], and this user's indefinite block on enwiki. Quite frankly, I think the desysop was long overdue. --'''[[User:Rschen7754\|Rs]][[User talk:Rschen7754\|chen]][[Special:Contributions/Rschen7754\|7754]]''' 07:56, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) Homosexuality and the promotion of homosexuality have always been illegal in the criminal code of Ethiopia, where most Amharic speakers are located. It is not only offensive to me, but for around 99% of Ethiopians, as it is considered inimical to the family spirit for which Ethiopia stands, and this is clearly stated in the criminal code. For this reason, promotion of homosexuality will not be tolerated here nor will it be forced down our throats to suit anyone's international political agenda if you expect Ethiopians to take part. It is also against our policy to allow username activity advertizing one's sexual lifestyle as we are family friendly and wish to remain that way. In nearly 15 years of operation this is the only offender to come to my attention, you will notice virtually no one else uses their name to advertise their sexual persusion and how abnormal this is. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 23:04, 6 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :Thanks for your answer. Could you please explain how it is promoting homosexuality? One can’t just mention the word “Queer” on the name, which has many possible interpretations according to dictionary? What if I change my name to “Teles Straight”? Would you block me too? Do you really expect that the whole community will follow Ethiopia laws?” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 23:28, 6 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::Yes, concepts like the rule of law are paramount in Ethiopia and so far there has been almost no problem in 15 years with expecting the Amharic community to follow the laws. It is easy to block anyone here if there is going to be any problem. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 23:35, 6 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :::Sorry, but it doesn’t make sense. Wikimedia sites are not built on Ethiopia soil, so there is no obligation to any user that doesn’t live there to follow its law. If you live there and don’t want to “promote homosexuality” it is your call. If using the name “Queer” is a crime in your country, that’s a real bummer, and as an Ethiopian citizen, YOU may want to avoid it. However, servers of this site are located on United States, and that is why every user, including you, are forced to follow its law. Wikimedia projects are free to create its own rules and develop by themselves the way it’s believed to be better on its on view, BUT they cannot do anything that works in opposition with Wikimedia Terms of Use and mission. I profoundly recommend you to review this action and position. This is a clear case of prejudice on which someone is blocked for their sexual orientation. You may decide not to abide to WMF Terms of Use; you are not forced to live with homosexuals. However, you may want to exercise this prejudice in places that fits better with this odd behaviour, which any Wikipedia is not. Regards.” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 00:05, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::::What part are you failing to comprehend? The "sexual orientation" as you call it is nothing but a crime in Ethiopia. It is grossly offensive to Ethiopian culture. This could be evidence that foreign advocates of homosexuality would intend to make platforms to preach this crime to countries where it is not wanted. You are barking up the wrong tree since there will be zero tolerance on Amharic. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 00:16, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :::::Zero tolerance to what exactly? Homosexuality?” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 00:27, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :That and also any disruption to the fine Ethiopian character of the wiki which has an Ethiopian character is banned like would be done in Ethiopia! [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 00:35, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::This project is not based on Ethiopia laws. That’s what you are not understanding. It’s really sad to know about this behavior here. You will hear more about this case soon. Regards.” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 00:44, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :What is sad is that your only function on this project appears to be as a foreign advocate of homosexuality and you continue to argue , leaving me with no choice but to block you as well for creating a disturbance. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 00:48, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::My function here was to talk to you about a clear abusive block. My intention was to tell you how mistaken that was and why, trying to fix it with arguments. I am honestly sad that your country has “zero tolerance” to homosexuality. I also live in a third world country and know that laws can be anachronistic. However, as volunteers of Wikipedia, we have to abide to Wikimedia movement mission. Instead of discriminating, you should be working to provide a good environment on which different people can contribute with their knowledge. I repeat my recommendation. If you don’t want to work on a place that respects any sexual orientation, it’s up to you, but this place is not any Wikimedia project. I hope things get better there in a near future. Regards.” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 01:27, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ▲::Don't ~~Thanks~~force your sick values on Ethiopia -- you will regret it! [[አባል:FæTil Eulenspiegel\|FæTil Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:FæTil Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 0201:2531, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :Why would I regret it? Understand once for all: this is not Ethiopia and there is nothing being forced there. This is just Amharic Language Wikipedia, which happens to be a project that should welcome lesbians, gays, bissexuals, transgenders, etc.” [[user:Teles\|'''T'''<sub>eleS</sub>]] ([[User talk:Teles\|<font color="#EC2300">'''T'''</font>]] <sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub>) 01:38, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::Those Ethiopian laws and your discriminating attitude are homophobic and disgusting, and should not be tolerated at all by the Wikimedia Foundation. I am glad [[User:MarcoAurelio]] swiftly responded by taking away your permissions. [[አባል:Robin van der Vliet\|Robin van der Vliet]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Robin van der Vliet\|talk]]) 01:42, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) :No, actually homosexuals are considered subhuman by the vast majority of Ethiopians. Removing my management with no warning or appeal is typical hamfistedness, like Ethiopia dealt with in 1936.! . [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 01:45, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::I'm sorry, are you advocating [[:en:Second Italo-Ethiopian War\|war]] to promote homophobia on Wikipedia? [[አባል:Vermont\|Vermont]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Vermont\|talk]]) 01:49, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::This is far from acceptable. I am finishing my participation here. I will keep working other ways to rule out this kind of behavior from Wiki.—[[User:Teles\|Teles]] «[[User talk:Teles\|<span style="text-shadow: 0.1em 0.1em 0.5em gray">'''Talk to me'''</span>]]˱<small><sub>[[:m:user talk:Teles\|M]] [[Special:Emailuser/Teles\|@]] [[Special:Contributions/Teles\|C]] [[sulutil:Teles\|S]]</sub></small>˲» 01:54, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::: I don't understand what homophobia is. Only homosexuals seem to know what it means when receive they militantly persecute anyone who dissents from them, with their firebrands and pitchforks. This is not an Amharic-translatable concept, it's not even proper English as it originated in recent decades as a homosexual slang term and no one else really knows what it means. If it means everything in human society that they want to destroy, I suppose it would be what we call not homophobia but "civilization" - thousands of years of it. [[አባል:Til Eulenspiegel\|Til Eulenspiegel]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Til Eulenspiegel\|talk]]) 01:59, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC) ::::Let's have anoter shot at it, shall we? Language is not owned by a country. And Ethiopian laws are applicable to only those websites which have their server located in Ethiopia. Otherwise there is no compulsion. An example would be: homosexuality is illegal in Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. But that does not stop any Arabic language website from using words related to "homosexuality". And while we are at it, "queer" may also mean "something that is very different from the general trend", and not necessarily pertaining to the sexual orientation.<br>[[አባል:Acagastya\|Acagastya]] ([[አባል ውይይት:Acagastya\|talk]]) 12:45, 7 ጃንዩዌሪ 2019 (UTC)

Codex Sinaiticus